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First All Grain brew
I made my first all grain batch this weekend but had problems.
Here's the recipe and then I'll go into the problem I had.
I used beer tools and estimated a 60% efficiency.
4.25 gallons
6 pds two row
.5 pd 20 L crystal
.65 pd victory
1 oz glacier hop pellets 6% AA 50 min
1 oz Liberty hop pellets 3.4 % AA 2 min
2 packets muntons premium gold yeast
OG: was suppose to be 1.034
Actual OG: 1.022
I heated up 2 gallons of water to 165 degrees. Added grains, stirred, and put lid on pot. Let sit for 75 min. temp never got below 155 degrees.
I heated up 1.5 gallons of water to 185 degrees, sparged grains with that. I used a 3 gallon boild and toped off to 4.25 with cold water.
everything went fine until I measured the OG. So seeing it was low I went back to beer tools and figured my efficiency was only 40% and to get OG where I wanted it I boiled 3/4 pd of cane sugar and added it to carboy. retook OG and it was 1.032, close enough. So my question is why was my efficiency so low? I had the grains crushed at the brew supply where I bought them. I stirred the grains to make sure all got good and wet, no lumps, before timing the mash for 75 minutes. Using stovetop I could only boil 3 gallons until I get another pot. Suggestions?
And yes it is based on brewchez recipe he posted last week for a simple english bitter. I just used hops I had.
DC
Your temps were way too high.....you should try mashing closer to 150. A mash temp that high has a lower conversion ratio, and thus not ns fermentable a wort. Also, not being to do a full boil changes things as well.....but it sems like you came up with a quick fix....hopefully, your first AG batch turns out good..congrats on making the move. Only better beers await you now....
Thanks for the reply. I based the temps on another sites instructions for stoptop all grain brew. The temp he used in his example was 153 for mash but it was for a specific beer so maybe that's where I messed up as you said, too high. thanks. I also thought of boiling in two pots but don't know if I have to split the hops up too or if I can put the hops in one pot and boil some of the wort in another pot to get a full boil, or if doing that will still give a lower efficiency.
DC
You could do a two pot boil, then combine them for pitching. If you want a 4 gallon finish, you need to be boiling about 5 1/2 gallons or a bit less to make up for evaporation. Also, chilling is obviously much more difficult when you can't top off with cold water. You probably need a wort chiller, and just do one pot at a time, or buy two...
As for the hops, just split them proportionately in each boil pot. You could also calculate the recipe to 2.5 gallons, and then just make it twice....
I use the following for calculating mash temps, volumes, sparge, and a few other things....
http://www.rackers.org/calcs.shtml
http://kotmf.com/tools/
Remember....RDWHAHB!
ricka182 wrote:
Your temps were way too high.....you should try mashing closer to 150. A mash temp that high has a lower conversion ratio, and thus not ns fermentable a wort.
Mash temp won't diminish OG/efficiency much. You'll still get soluble carbohydrates from the grains.. They might just be in the form of starches not sugars. If that's the case you can still get great efficiency, just really poor attentuation, i.e. a really high FG.
Deafcone:
Can you better describe how you sparged the grain? What method of sparging were you trying to emulate, Batch or fly (or something else)?
With 2 gallons of mash water and 1.5 gallons of sparge water I am curious how you got a 3 gallon boil. That means you only had 0.5 gallons of absorption. With your relatively thick mash ratio (1.13qts/lb) I would have expected to lose more water. Did you add water to the boil after sparge to get to 3 gallons?
I think the issues with your efficiency are related first to the sparging.
I am also curious about your mash temp. You said it never got below 155...but what was the starting temp? Your strike water was 165F so after mixing with the grain, what mash temp did you hit to start with? Again, I don't think its critical for efficiency, just curious to better understand your process.
deafcone wrote:
And yes it is based on brewchez recipe he posted last week for a simple english bitter. I just used hops I had.
I posted a bitter recipe last week??? I must be loosing it because I don't remember that.
Ahhh...yes that makes more sense. Mash temps still important, but more towards FG than OG......
brewchez wrote:
ricka182 wrote:
Your temps were way too high.....you should try mashing closer to 150. A mash temp that high has a lower conversion ratio, and thus not ns fermentable a wort.
Mash temp won't diminish OG/efficiency much. You'll still get soluble carbohydrates from the grains.. They might just be in the form of starches not sugars. If that's the case you can still get great efficiency, just really poor attentuation, i.e. a really high FG.
Deafcone:
Can you better describe how you sparged the grain? What method of sparging were you trying to emulate, Batch or fly (or something else)?
With 2 gallons of mash water and 1.5 gallons of sparge water I am curious how you got a 3 gallon boil. That means you only had 0.5 gallons of absorption. With your relatively thick mash ratio (1.13qts/lb) I would have expected to lose more water. Did you add water to the boil after sparge to get to 3 gallons?
I think the issues with your efficiency are related first to the sparging.
I am also curious about your mash temp. You said it never got below 155...but what was the starting temp? Your strike water was 165F so after mixing with the grain, what mash temp did you hit to start with? Again, I don't think its critical for efficiency, just curious to better understand your process.deafcone wrote:
And yes it is based on brewchez recipe he posted last week for a simple english bitter. I just used hops I had.
I posted a bitter recipe last week??? I must be loosing it because I don't remember that.
I used a grain bag 18x32 inches. After water came to 165 I wrapped bag around pot, put grains in bag, stirred up good to get all grains wet, put lid on. I checked temp a couple minutes after I added the grain and it was 155. It stayed there for the 75 minutes.
I ten took the bag out, let it drain into pot, then put bag loosly in another pot with sparge water in it and heated to 185, I stirred it up good and let sit ten minutes.
Site I used the method from said mash water should be 165 before adding grains as grains will drop temp to about 154 ish. That was close.
Also said that hte sparge water should be 185 for same reason, grains will drop temp to 170. I didn't check the temp of the sparge water after I added the grain.
Also, I did top off to get the 3 gallons for boil. So I am assuming I should have used more sparge water and lost some fermentables still left in grains. Correct?
Here's the link to the site I used and it has step by step instructions. Seemed ok till I measured the OG. Then I added the boiled sugar to get the gravity up where it ahould have been.
http://www.homebrewtalk.com/f39/easy-st … ics-90132/
thanks for the help.
Actually the recipe I was refering to was on your other web site (brewdudes). I was looking for an all grain recipe and came across it there. It was the pub bitter recipe.
DC
deafcone wrote:
Also, I did top off to get the 3 gallons for boil. So I am assuming I should have used more sparge water and lost some fermentables still left in grains. Correct?
Yep that is likely the source of your efficiency issues. Next time I would suggest laying the bag in a collander over an empty pot. Then slowly pour a few quarts at a time of sparge water through the grain bag. You'll get a better sparge that way.
Even better is you should make a mash tun with a 3 or 5 gallon cooler and a braided hose in the bottom. This will be much better for smaller mashes. The bag method is OK, but no one really describes a good technique for getting an adequate sparge. Its likely you left a lot of sugars in the grains.
deafcone wrote:
Actually the recipe I was refering to was on your other web site (brewdudes). I was looking for an all grain recipe and came across it there. It was the pub bitter recipe.
DC
Ahhh, well I hope you try that recipe again in the future. I am glad someone is finding that site useful.
Hey, I think Brewdudes is useful......I can't remember where, but I saw a reference to it on another beer site....someday, I'll get around to brewing a few Brewchez specialties......
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