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I could use a little advice on a recipe.
First of all, I'd like to apologize for not being as active on the boards as I once was. My free time and money for brewing was cut drastically after my 2nd daughter was born this past July. Things are starting to stabilize a little bit now, so I'm starting to dip my toes back into the fermentation bucket so to speak.
Now to the point. A buddy in my homebrew club got his hands on a fair amount of raw cacao nibs recently. He broke it up into half pound baggies and passed a lot of it out to members of the club who wanted to brew with them. The idea is that we're gonna have a little in house compeition with the beers that are produced. He gave me some of the nibs, but not until it was too late to brew anything that I could enter into this comp. Nontheless, I'd still like to brew something with them that I can enter into other competitions & I'd also like to give dude a 6 pack of what I brew with them in seeing that he was nice enough to give me the free nibs in the 1st place.
The cacao nibs are raw and need to be roasted. Can anybody give me an idea as to how to go about it? I suppose I could just google it, but I figured that I check to see if anyone here had any 1st hand experience with roasting them. I trust you guys more than I trust some random guy off the web.
Next, I'd like to get your input on the recipe I came up with. I've decided that I'd like to bring some sweet and some heat to this beer, and I think that a tropical feel would be an interesting way to go. To that end I plan on brewing a Chocolate Foreign Extra Stout (Caribbean style) with Habanero. Here's the recipe:
Chocolate Habanero FX Stout
Category Stout
Subcategory Foreign Extra Stout
Recipe Type All Grain
Batch Size 5.5 gal.
Volume Boiled 7.5 gal.
Mash Efficiency 84 %
Total Grain/Extract 13.00 lbs.
Total Hops 3.0 oz.
10 lbs. English 2-row Pale
.75 lbs. Roasted Barley
.75 lbs. 2-Row Caramel Malt 80L
.75 lbs. 2-Row Caramel Malt 40L
.5 lbs. Chocolate Malt
.25 lbs. Black Patent
2.5 oz. East Kent Goldings (Pellets, 5.00 %AA) boiled 60 min.
.5 oz. East Kent Goldings (Pellets, 5.00 %AA) boiled 0 min.
4 oz. Cacao nibs (in the secondary)
2 ea. Habaneros (1 during last 15 of the boil, the other maybe in the secondary if I use it at all. Both seeded w/ membranes removed.)
2 ea. Vanilla (whole bean) (Maybe in the secondary. I'm not sure if I'm gonna use them.)
Yeast : White Labs WLP013 London Ale
Original Gravity 1.068
Terminal Gravity 1.014
Color 30.97 °SRM
Bitterness 56.0 IBU
Alcohol (%volume) 7.1 %
Go ahead an be brutal about ripping apart the recipe.
As far as the habaneros go, I'm not sure what I'm gonna do with them yet. I might add one to the boil, I might not. The same thing goes with adding one to the secondary. I'm kinda looking for some input from you guys on that one. I was thinking about adding one to the boil for the last 15 mins and then I'll see what that gives me a day before I rack the beer. If I think I need more habanero I would soak one in vodka and dump it into the secondary upon racking. Habanero is one of those things thats easy to overdo, but it's also easy to underdo. It can be tricky to find a decent balance with them. I also expect to get a different flavor from a "dry hopped" pepper versus one that went into the boil.
Also, I only plan on using half my nibs in this batch. If the habanero is too much, I was thinking that I could rebrew the beer without the peppers and blend the 2 batchs to reduce the heat. I know that's not ideal, but if I screw it up, that might be the only way to fix it. I'm assuming of course that 4 oz of cacao nibs is enough for a 5 gal batch of beer. (looking for some reassurance on this) If all is good, then I can always rebrew the recipe as is.
I'm also not sure about adding some vanilla to the beer. I think that vanilla would work nicely with the chocolate, but I dunno if I really need it. I'd use a whole bean or two in the secondary. What do you guys think?
And the reason for the fameout hop addition is just to give a touch of EKG in the aroma, and so I don't have half an ounce of hops sitting in my freezer waiting for me to get around to brewing another beer that could use EKGs.
Well, I think that's everything I wanted to cover. Thanks for any advice you guys can offer.
It sounds like you really thought this one through! I have never used the cocoa nibs before, although have been wanting to.
As far as the base recipe, it looks very solid, the only I would do which is from personal taste, is to back the crystals down to .5 # each, and add .5 # of special B. You have a lot going on as far as savory complexity, so the dark fruit that special B imparts I think would be a subtle addition and play off everything else.
As far as the rest is difficult because you are going towards a savory molee type of profile, and it is all about the subtle balance, no one element should stand out. So for that I would back off on the vanilla bean. going with .5 to 1 whole bean. I think 2 is just too much and would be overly accented. Vanilla is always welcome when chocolate is around, but only as a supporting role here. As far as the habernero, I would skip the boil, and use a dried version in the secondary. the fresh hab will give off oils, and I have had a beer like this and it almost coats and stings the throat, and starts to burn over time. All spices get very well utilized in a secondary, so I would perhaps use only 1 dried hab, (which I believe the smoked version is a chipotle, I use dried non smoked in some beef rubs)
Sounds like a great experiment, you may also want to try just pulling off maybe a quart or so and do a satellite secondary, and test your spice levels on that , and then see how they balance.
Cant wait to hear the outcome!
chipotle is a smoked dried jalapeno, I don't think dried habenero has a special name. But they are hot, so a little will go a long way. try one first, and if it's not hot enough add a second.
@ Thirsty
I knew you were going to say special B.
I gotta take a closer look at that malt.
brewchez wrote:
@ Thirsty
I knew you were going to say special B.
I gotta take a closer look at that malt.
You know my affinity to this malt. When looking at the flavor contributions of the range of crystals, it walks throughh the light caramel, into the deep caramel, then into the light nut and fruity, finally into the dark nut and fruity. Spec B is at the far end of that spectrum and I feel although a little goes a loong way, this malt gives a fruitiness that compliments a fruity yeast- making a spectacular complexity. When there are other big flavors involved, it remains a subtle but thankful addition.
That could be why I love Ommegang Abbey so much- hop on the special B train!
Hogarthe wrote:
chipotle is a smoked dried jalapeno, I don't think dried habenero has a special name. But they are hot, so a little will go a long way. try one first, and if it's not hot enough add a second.
Thats what I was thinking. Crossed up my chiles! My buddy gave me a huge bag from the garden and I have some dried anaheims, some dried arbols, and some dried haberneros. Spinning one of these up in my spice grinder and it makes for a ridiculous addition to a sugar based rub.
That could be why I love Ommegang Abbey so much- hop on the special B train!
I am finding special B In almost all of my recepies
+1 on chipotles being dried smoked Jalapenos and a little definitely goes a long way. I have a robust porter that I did with chipotle in the secondary. 5 days was waaaaaaaay overkill, with 2 whole chipotle peppers. I ended up brewing a second batch just to blend the two and I could have done a third batch to blend 2 to 1.
peppers are hard to control.you can always add more later
ID
Actually, Special B is exactally what this beer needs. I shoulda thought of it myself... Thanks for the idea Thirsty.
Unfortunately dried habs are out altogether. Nobody sells 'em in Philly. I can't get dried chipotles either, just the canned ones in adobo. I was suprised to find that one local super market just started selling dried chile de arbols. There are a lot of spices that you would think are common, like smoked paprika, that you simply never see for sale in this city. It's quite frustrating actually.
Anywhoo, I'm going to be using fresh peppers. I'm actually hoping to use Scotch Bonnets. Scotch Bonnets are a type of habanero, but they're a touch milder and have a little more of the fruity notes. They pop up for sale here every now and again for a little bit, then disappear for awhile. I just got my hands on some, but I'm not sure if they'll still be good when it's time to add it to the beer so they'll probably go into a Jamaican jerk recipe of some kind. If they are still available, then that's what I'll use. If not, then it'll just be a regular hab.
Here's the revised recipe:
Special FXS
March 22, 2011
Category Stout
Subcategory Foreign Extra Stout
Recipe Type All Grain
Batch Size 5.5 gal.
Volume Boiled 7.5 gal.
Mash Efficiency 84 %
Total Grain/Extract 12.75 lbs.
Total Hops 3.0 oz.
10 lbs. English 2-row Pale
.5 lbs. Roasted Barley
.5 lbs. 2-Row Caramel Malt 80L
.5 lbs. 2-Row Caramel Malt 40L
.5 lbs. English Chocolate Malt
.5 lbs. Special B - Caramel malt
.25 lbs. British Black Patent
2.5 oz. East Kent Goldings (Pellets, 5.00 %AA) boiled 60 min.
.5 oz. East Kent Goldings (Pellets, 5.00 %AA) boiled .0 min.
4 oz. Chocolate (unsweetened) (Cacao nibs in secondary)
1 ea. Chili Peppers (Habanero or Scotch Bonnet. In the secondary. Seeded w/ membranes removed.)
1 ea. Vanilla (whole bean) (In the secondary.)
Yeast : White Labs WLP013 London Ale
Original Gravity 1.067
Terminal Gravity 1.014
Color 30.34 °SRM
Bitterness 56.2 IBU
Alcohol (%volume) 7.0 %
Any thoughts?
As far as roasting the nibs is concerned, it looks like 250° F for 20 minutes in the oven should do the trick. After cooling, dehusking and winnowing, I think I'm gonna crush 'em a little bit with a rolling pin and soak in vodka to sanitize them before adding them to the batch.
Thanks for the feedback so far.
you could dry them yourself in the oven, or a dehydrator. To keep them around if you want to use them, you could try pickling them, but then the flavor might be weird for using in a beer. Someone's got to have more variety if you look enough. try farmers markets or even flea markets. I about burned my mouth completely off my face by eating a habanero I got at the flea market in town. that's when I learned the important lesson, don't eat habanero peppers by themselves.
+1 on not eating Habanero peppers by themselves. If you don't die right then and there, there is a good chance you will the next morning. 
Mort... if you really want I can ship you almost any kinda pepper you want from the great state of Texas. This is the time of year that they start showing up in the Grocery store, corner store, gas station. and in between the mesquite firewood guy and the stolen electronics guy on the side of the road. Let me know
ID
Irondavy wrote:
Mort... if you really want I can ship you almost any kinda pepper you want from the great state of Texas. This is the time of year that they start showing up in the Grocery store, corner store, gas station. and in between the mesquite firewood guy and the stolen electronics guy on the side of the road. Let me know
ID
Thats what makes this site so great!!
More than just unpredictability, I was also thinking the oils from the fresh pepper may not be so good. Using 1 or 2 of the arbols may not be a bad bet, but personally I would take ID up on his offer. Use it sparingly, because again it is all about contribution, not standout. If the heat stands out and is noticable, my opinion is it would be too much. I think the rest of the recipe looks spot on solid!
I already made the mistake of eating a whole raw habanero a few years back before I ever used one in a dish. Trust me, that's a mistake you only make once.
Thanks for the offer ID, I really appreciate it. I'm sure I can also find on-line resources for them too, if I really want them. I'm sorry if I implied that's there absolutely no way for me to aquire dried habs. They are really hard to find (if not impossible) locally, but the internet is a big place. I'm sure I can find someone who is selling them on-line.
Thirsty, as far as I can tell you really shouldn't lose the spicy oils in the pepper when they're dried. All the research I've done on it suggests the opposite to be true, that the heat tends to become more concentrated after drying (one site said that dried chilies could be up to 10 times hotter than fresh) rather than losing strength during the drying process. I dunno if using dried over fresh would make any real difference once it's added to five gallons of beer. Maybe there's something I'm not understanding correctly here?
My plan is to remove the seeds from the pepper and remove the membranes, that should significantly reduce the heat in the pepper.
In the end it might be worth an experiment. I might brew 2 batches of the stuff, one using fresh peppers & the other using dried to see if there's a big difference. I'll be sure to put aside a few bottles for the sake of comparison once this batch is done.
I plan on heading to my LHBS tomorrow to pick up the ingredients to brew this up. Hopefully I'll get it brewed up some time this week.
I used 1/2 an habenero in a 5 gallon batch of beer years ago and it was very good. I used an amber ale recipe and deseeded the habenero. cut it in half, and put it in water that was boiling hot but no on the birner any more. let it steep in that for about 15 minutes and dropped it in the secondary. tasted like a normal amber ale and the heat snuck up on you after you swollowed. a whole habenero should be fine for the stout recipe.
And some people think scotch bonnets and habenros are the same thing but they're not but they are close enough to swap out in a recipe if one or the other can't be found.
And I would add it to 2ndry instead of boil. use less ppper that way and get more umph in heat. JMO
DC
Mortician607 wrote:
I already made the mistake of eating a whole raw habanero a few years back before I ever used one in a dish. Trust me, that's a mistake you only make once.
Thanks for the offer ID, I really appreciate it. I'm sure I can also find on-line resources for them too, if I really want them. I'm sorry if I implied that's there absolutely no way for me to aquire dried habs. They are really hard to find (if not impossible) locally, but the internet is a big place. I'm sure I can find someone who is selling them on-line.
Thirsty, as far as I can tell you really shouldn't lose the spicy oils in the pepper when they're dried. All the research I've done on it suggests the opposite to be true, that the heat tends to become more concentrated after drying (one site said that dried chilies could be up to 10 times hotter than fresh) rather than losing strength during the drying process. I dunno if using dried over fresh would make any real difference once it's added to five gallons of beer. Maybe there's something I'm not understanding correctly here?
My plan is to remove the seeds from the pepper and remove the membranes, that should significantly reduce the heat in the pepper.
In the end it might be worth an experiment. I might brew 2 batches of the stuff, one using fresh peppers & the other using dried to see if there's a big difference. I'll be sure to put aside a few bottles for the sake of comparison once this batch is done.
I plan on heading to my LHBS tomorrow to pick up the ingredients to brew this up. Hopefully I'll get it brewed up some time this week.
Heat is in the membrane and seeds. so if you use fresh you can save the seeds, dry them, and use them in future batches by just putting them in a hop sack or cheese cloth. you could likely even use red pepper flakes used on pizzas in same way.
DC
Okay, the beer was brewed a couple of weeks ago and I'm roasting up the cocoa nibs tonight. I picked up some scotch bonnets today, so with any luck I'll be racking the beer on to the vanilla, nibs, and pepper tomorrow. I picked up a nice potato vodka so soak everything in.
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